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13127267 minutes ago, Sqeek said:
It is not bad, not at all. The standing sway, on the other hand, is annoying for anyone using the gun and I believe it is even harder for new players to handle. I have previously written this many times on these forums, but compared to the other ARs the standing sway is just ridiculous. I believe that is the main reason why there are so many complaints on the forums.
Looking at the numbers, the AVS-36 indeed has more recoil and sway than the other weapons. That's not something I will deny or anything in that direction, when I open the stat sheets, it clearly shows it.
However and I don't know why, the gun is performing very well. I personally don't like the gun at all, even when it was OP I didn't really like it. Then again right now I'm also using the Johnson over the Carbine as I just don't really like the carbine and it clearly shows the carbine is performing way better. I also prefer the MG-13 over the Johnson, which is also performing lower than then Johnson. So my own gameplay experiences, don't really match up with the reality. If I would balance purely on my own opinions and biases, it would probably be pretty good for the Soviets and United States, but not so much for the Germans. Which is exactly why I always take the stats as basis.
If people say 'AVS has too much sway' and the AVS is underperforming, I know that it's the sway I need to balance it on.
But when people say 'AVS has too much sway' but the AVS isn't underperforming at all, I won't reduce the sway, because apparently it performs good enough with the strong sway.
I unfortunately don't know the exact number changes in the last update when it comes to the AVS-36, so I can't really say where the biggest changes have been to make it feel less powerful.
But looking at just the k/d of the AVS-36, it hasn't actually changed. If I look at the average AVS score from may till now, it's actually 0,01 higher when I only look at october and november. Difference is though that the STG-44 and the M2 carbine went up in average score.
The images I shared, are literally the weapon stats. I have removed the numbers and details, but those lines are screenshots from the stats, not something I made in paint of anything. I'm not actually supposed to share statistics like that and by showing these images I'm probably already sharing a bit more than I should, but I just wanted to show this to explain the reasoning behind it all.
Unfortunetly these changes won't be on live upcoming build yet, there were a bit too many other tasks to complete, so this was pushed back a little.
Headshot multiplier will be in this month.
The forum survey was voted upon a lot by double accounts.15 hours ago, hoko90 said:
Pool result with over 4000 participants behind CLOSED DOORS which there`s no democratic way to verify and confirm, sure reto guys, I call this BS, we are not little kids to beleive such BS.
Do Reto devs really think that a little, almost invisible change of 0.42x would make things good and would reduce the damn cancer random headshots? How about 1x which will have a big noticable change to the gameplay and the rng HS cancer treatment?
When it comes to fvck things up, they always go big and OVERNERF shirts only to take off a lot of players but, when it comes to solve actual game issues to please their players, they always go small and barely have any good impact on the said issues.
I am, from my place, I would NOMINATE Reto Moto company to win Guinness record as the most Game Studio in the ART of Pissing Off players worldwide.
No this is what YOU want, not what 'the community' wants.
Also stop with calling everything you don't like BS. I certainly do think you are a little kid if you think like that.
We didn't have to do a poll, it would have been a lot easier for me and a lot less time consuming to just never do a poll.
If you don't like the results that is too bad, but these are the results and you will just have to deal with that.
I actually had the rules that at least 60% had to have voted 'change' to change anything at all. Less people voted on that, and we still decided to make a small change, which we figured would not really hurt the people who didn't want any change.
The 2.0 vote on the forums was very heavily voted upon by double accounts. I doubt it would still have won had I gone through all the double accounts.
I will close this topic until i know when we will go through with the weapon balancing changes. No useful feedback is really shared here anymore either way.
This was the result of the update we did in april:
Yellow = AVS-36
STG-44 = red
M2 carbine = blue
This is the update we did in October:
And this is how it looks since October until last Sunday:
Back in march-april, the difference between the AVS-36 and the M2 carbine was about 28% on average.
From april till october, the difference between the same two guns, was about 13%.
The average difference now between the AVS-36 and the STG-44, is about 4%.
Now let's add the Johnson in there, which is currently the best performing LMG (ignoring the FG-42, which is actually performing quite a bit better)
This is once again about a 25% difference between the AR's and the LMG's.
Which is a gap we wish to decrease, by moving the AR's down a little and the LMG's up a little.
Also with in mind the performance of SMG's and HMG's. Which are about where we want them to perform.7 minutes ago, aanton1 said:
hahahha there he goes with the statistics again
Sorry for using facts, how dare I.
In the last week, the AVS-36 had a higher average score than the M2 carbine. Overal there is almost no difference between the M2 carbine and the AVS-36. The STG-44 is slightly above it, but only by a very small margin. Assault rifles have never been so close to each other in terms of performance.
There is absolutely no indication that the AVS-36 is a bad gun compared to the other two AR's.
189646448 minutes ago, AllenGs93 said:
The thing you still continue to (intentionally) ignore is that A GUN WITH ONLY 15 BULLETS SHOULD NOT BE UNDERPERFOMING AT ALL COMPARED TO OTHER AR'S.10% reduction in sway IS NOTHING.I keep repeating myself because you continue to not give a s*** about what players of the game tell you!
Sqeek you are losing your time brother.The guy doesnt even play the game,doesnt give a s*** and keeps talking about statistics.Literally every SU veteran i know of gave up on the avs since the last update.But according to hades ''statistics'' are never wrong : )
I mean, statistics are literally always correct. That's why they are statistics, they are literally facts.
Of course they can be influenced by all kinds of elements, but captured weapons have been taken out of the equation already, as those can only be used unmodded.
That only veterans would use the weapon is also not the case, as I can see the use of the gun is not vastly different from the STG-44 or the M2 carbine. It's used less, but this is mostly due to the fact there are also less players. When I look at the ratio of players using it, it's on par.
We can see on the range of the kills, that the AVS is not having issues shooting targets that are further away. And it overall just follows the same trajectory of the STG-44.
I mean, you can repeat yourself as much as you want, it's simply not true what you are saying. And your arguement 'he doesn't play' is simply not true. I play the game plenty. 10-20 hours a week on average. But I deliberately don't balance the game too much on my own opinions. In my opinion, the M2 carbine is horrible. I don't like it at all. But the stats show that it's performing properly so I ignore my own opinion on that aspect. I deliberately, take stats over player experience, because my own experiences often do not line up with the stats. And then I can decide to push through my opinion, the opinion of 1 player, or I can look into the stats showing the experiences of tens or even hundreds of thousands.
It doesn't mean the players perspective on weapons is wrong, a gun can just feel more difficult to use and despite not underperforming, still just doesn't feel nice, which is something we do try to address. This is the whole reason why I am reducing the sway. Sway is 'random' while recoil is more predictable. I have also received quite a few comment that state they prefer more recoil over more sway. Which is something I have taken into account.
If I didn't care what players were saying, I would have just removed your (very hostile) comments and ignored it.
However, I try to take my time to explain why I'm doing things. And I have often been influenced by reactions on changes.
But that doesn't mean because you decide to just 'scream' and 'threaten' with not playing the game, I will simply forget about the statistics and completely focus on what you want.
If every veteran gave up the AVS, and the only players left using it are 'random' players, it would actually point out the AVS is still overpowered, as these 'new players' are getting almost the same results as the mix of new players and veterans on other factions. So that arguement is not helping your case.
18964642 minutes ago, AllenGs93 said:
Yeah keep looking at ''statistics'' and dont play the game.You still dont get what i am saying,a gun with only 15 bullets shouldnt be ''SLIGHTLY OFF'' compared to other AR's with 30 bullets!Do you even realise how restarted this is?And another bs you stated is ''But when looking at the modded versions, the difference between the guns is very limited''.Compare AVS SCOPED VS M2 SCOPED AND STG SCOPED.The other 2 are accurate AF while the AVS cant hit s*** because of mega sway and penalty per bullet!But the biggest bs you told us is ''Unmodded, it's actually the 2nd best weapon in the game. It performs better than either the STG-44 or the M2 carbine modded.''.Ok dude,keep mocking us,eventually the SU will go on a strike again and the game will lose 1/3 of the people playing it BECAUSE YOU NEVER LISTEN!That's it for me,i wont even bother to say anything more.Keep destroying the game!You are pretty good at it.
If you don't want to believe it that's up to you. But this is simply the truth. I play the game plenty, but that's irrelevant.
My gameplay experience is entirely different from the experience from other players. Stats are based on the gameplay of thousands of players however and not based on the opinion of a few.
AVS-36 is barely underperforming. If you don't want to play because of the balancing changes, that's a shame of course, but that doesn't suddenly make you right.
We're not going to make a weapon OP because you won't play if we don't.
I really also don't understand the problem here from the Soviet faction.
Like I repeated 10 times, the Soviets are getting the smallest nerfs and the biggest buffs.
Clearly it can, as the statistics show the gun is performing well. Personal experience certainly does not have more meaning than what the statistics show.
STG-44 and AVS-36 have about the same kill-spread when it comes to range, where 3,5% are on long range.
M2 carbine only scores 1,6% there but does indeed perform better cqc.
The AVS-36 is a very small bit under the other 2 weapons. Unmodded, it's actually the 2nd best weapon in the game. It performs better than either the STG-44 or the M2 carbine modded.
It is possible however a lot of people use captured versions of it still, which could boost the performance of the weapon.
But when looking at the modded versions, the difference between the guns is very limited. The usage of the weapons is about the same percentage of the faction population. Nothing points in the direction of the weapon being 'horrible' or even 'bad'. It's slightly off compared to the it's counterparts, which is why we the changes are relatively better for the AVS than for the other two weapons.
But massive boosts and buffs are not necessary at all.
189646420 hours ago, AllenGs93 said:
Reto.Hades. Make up your mind!Increased sway when crouching?wtf.Increase camera recoil???WTF.And only 10% reduce in sway when standing???Really!?!?!?At this point go on and delete the AVS from the game as it is ALREADY s**t.AVS already has mega sway and is inaccurate AF right now especially when used with scope and trigger and you decide to make it MORE inaccurate.Good job for destroying the SU faction.Nerf AVS more and buff the STG and M2. G E N I U S ! ! !
1. Where do you see buffs for the STG and M2 carbine?
2. The AVS is not 'shit', it's still one of the best performing weapons in the game.
As shown before, the Soviets are getting the most buffs and least nerfs of any of the three faction this build.
So if you call this 'destroying SU faction', you are simply wrong. This build is by all means better for the Soviets than for the other factions.
The wikipedia is not maintained by us. I will close this topic. If you cannot put something up for discussion in a normal way, there is no reason to keep the topic going.
This subject unfortunately reminds me a lot of the current US elections, where there is simply a huge division in the opinions of the playerbase.
This subject also has a huge effect on the playerbase, which is why we are not convinced this is the right way to go ahead with such a small pool of players.
Based on this poll, there will be a meeting with management tomorrow (well, the meeting would happen either way but this is now simply an added subject ^^).
In that meeting, a decision will be made if we will make a public poll or not. We would in that case write a blogpost both on our website and on steam, to call up people to vote.
It would of course not be a binding poll and we would certainly hold on to at least the 60% needs to vote 'change' rule. But I do expect that we would follow the results of the poll in that case.
A small note, we can make a differentiation between certain weapons. Meaning that we can keep the pistols 1HK headshot.
If we go through with it, in the blogpost I will write down weapon by weapon which gun can and cannot 1HK headshot.
At least the important ones, PTRD and such I won't have to mention.
I might even differentiate between modded and unmodded versions
I will update this topic tomorrow to share if we will move forward with this or not.